FORCE

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Force in chiropractic philosophy is not the nerve impulse. It is the “wish” of the innate intelligence of the body that is being carried by the mental impulse. it is not just elecricity. Electricity can travel to the microwave, T.V. or in the form of a lightning bolt. But when you fip a light switch, it is different. That electricity is carrying “light purpose”. Is it the same as the electricity going to the TV? No! It may feel the same if you stick your finger in the outlet But it has a different purpose. That makes it different. Electricity going to the TV has “TV purpose”, to the microwave, “microwave purpose”. The purpose is determined by the appliance (physical matter) receiving it. Innate force is always different in that its purpose is not determined by the appliance (organ or part of the body) but by the intelligence creating it. That’s the difference between a mechanistic viewpoint and a vitalistic one.

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This article has 61 comments

  1. David Suskin 07/18/2014, 5:41 pm:

    Joe,
    So if:
    Force in chiropractic philosophy is not the nerve impulse. It is the “wish” of the innate intelligence of the body that is being carried by the mental impulse
    and The triune is Intelligence-Force-Matter, then what IS the mental Impulse?
    Isn’t the Mental Impulse the The Force (innate) or a nerve impulse that is converted by ii from a universal force (nerve impulse), that can carry the wish of ii, and thus NOW is a Mental Impulse?

    The Mental Impulse IS the description of Innate Force which is Communication of II Force which is the wish of ii, which is THE Mental Impulse?? yes/no (i’m telling the story over and over) BUT best not to be telling THE WRONG STORY OVER AND OVER –
    Please direct me >> am I thick? – Yikes! 🙂

    • Joe Strauss 07/18/2014, 9:19 pm:

      Dave, Here’s my take: a mental impulse is a physical/metaphysical phenomena. What I am calling the “wish” of the ii of the body, what Claude calls the “coding” is the metaphysical part. By analogy the metaphysical aspect of this post is my thought, the physical aspect is the 0’sand1’s of the computer or the dots and dashes of Morse or the ink and paper of a book. A nerve impulse is a purely physical phenomena, can be measured (EEG,EKG). A MI is a universal force that has been changed into a constructive IF (another name). If that uf is not “converted” into an IF then the ii of the body must adapt to it or it will tend to be destructive to the matter, depending on the condition of the matter and the strength of the uf.(The uf of the sun’s rays will be less harmful to the tissues of your body on a cloudy day as opposed to a sunny day and not at all if the ii of the body can adapt them by creating melanin. You wrote: “The Mental Impulse IS the description of Innate Force which is Communication of II Force which is the wish of ii, which is THE Mental Impulse? I would say that is correct.
      A nerve impulse is an electrical (physical phenomena), only. It is not created by the ii of the body. Two examples:
      1. The electrical charge used to restart a heart. It acts as a nerve impulse which the organ intelligence may adapt and cause the heart to pump until and if the body’s innate intelligence can take over. Remember if the heart has stopped, the ii of the body is no longer controlling its function.
      2. A vertebral subluxation. The metaphysical component is no longer there because the ii of the body has not been able to attach its message/wish to the physical nerve impulse. The nerve impulse now acts as a universal force and if the cellular intelligence can adapt it, it will be used for the selfish benefit of the cell but not for the benefit of the entire body, “cells gone wild” so to speak. It is now technically a cancer cell but because it is not part of the body it is more likely to die unless the body or the hands of a chiropractor can facilitate an adjustment and bring it back under the ii of the body’s control. Unable to do that it will try to destroy it usually with macrophage. Unable to do that, you have a cancer cell, which because it is not under the control of the ii of the body it is more susceptible to radiation or chemotherapy

      • David Suskin 07/18/2014, 9:50 pm:

        Joe,
        Yes, I applaud your #1 reply and I am glad that I am finally making some distinctions here. some! not all! some.
        But #2 is a problem for me. You’re basically saying that a subluxation, which many many many people have had, don’t know about and will have for the rest of their lives, in your words >> “will be used for the selfish benefit of the cell but not for the benefit of the entire body, “cells gone wild” so to speak. It is now technically a cancer cell but because it is not part of the body it is more likely to die”

        Are you saying, that everyone with a subluxation (as described above), if they are immune compromised (which again we know subluxations effect), WILL HAVE A LONE CANCER CELL(s). That’s a bold statement and certainly puts a BIG ONUS on the immunity of ALL THE PEOPLE WHO ARE SUBLUXATED NOW, THEN, AND ALWAYS!

        i’m just saying that celfish cells might have the benefit of other adaptations and while not be optimal, might be more atrophic then lone ATTACKERS. I mean, if that’s true Joe, then one could say quite alot to the PM’s that would well, have them running to ones office.

        Either way, it is a bold statement, and while I understand the logic, and premise, I just don’t know, logically what the reaction of a cell will be when it is acting celfishly (disconnected from ii).

        Or, you could be right in that REMOVE THE IMMUNE SYSTEM, (macrophages, etc. ) and a person might have, big, big problems.
        Thinking of all the people on immunosuppresive drugs (transplants, RA, all kinds of autoimmune ) >>>> and they’re subluxated!!!!! Well that’s a powder keg ready to take off.

        Any thoughts 🙂

      • David Suskin 07/19/2014, 4:06 am:

        Joe,
        You speak about this in away in philosophy 2 blue book referring to Creation transmission expression/intelligence force matter. I was re- thinking about your “cells gone wild” statement. You DO say “it’s more likely to die ” , plus the immune macrophage protection., so that covers a lot of ground with regards to probability of becoming a greater health hazard eg. Cancer. I only wonder about people with lets say kidney transplants. I personally know someone with a kidney transplant. The nervous system IS NOT rehooked up AND they must be on immune suppression drugs. They have survived for many years. I’m not presuming this is an optimal situation BUT what could innate intelligence be doing to allow this compensation if your killer cell model is or was indeed true. I have no explanation. And yes I don’t like using a disease model as an example BUT you brought up the subject of Cancer cell. Personally, I would have to assume that ii contact point with most tissues is primarily with the vasculature.
        That IS always a nervous system contact and does account perhaps for a ii transmission by innate force to even transplants or denervation subjects to organ vasculature intelligence to organ int to tissue to cell. IF there is NO subluxation.
        Again. A real live situation I’m trying to account for philosophically and practically

        • Joe Strauss 07/19/2014, 2:56 pm:

          Good question Dave. We must consider that the ii of the body has other means to control/coordinate body function. We just say that the nerve system is an important one and chiropractic’s area of interest. I have no problem with people addressing other areas (if there are any). I just have a problem with doing it as, or calling it chiropractic. As a side note: It is interesting to me that the RBC has no direct innervation but the ii of the body is able to control it in 2 ways:1. By controlling its movements through the blood vascular system and 2. By giving it a limited lifespan and no ability to reproduce (no nucleus). Its production is in the marrow of long bones, richly innervated. and their destruction is in the spleen , an organ with a nerve supply. As Claude would say “Amazing isn’t it?”

      • David Suskin 07/28/2014, 12:06 am:

        Joe,
        Rereading your comment you said
        ‘A nerve impulse is a purely physical phenomena, can be measured (EEG,EKG). A MI is a universal force that has been changed into a constructive IF (another name). If that uf is not “converted” into an IF then the ii of the body must adapt to it or it will tend to be destructive to the matter, depending on the condition of the matter and the strength of the uf.’
        Are you making reference to the subluxation? And if so does that mean that the subluxation can be adapted to by ii?
        That would seem to suggest that subluxations (universal force-nerve impulses) and their resulting nerve interference can be adapted to by other mental impulses that are not interfered with. That adaptation can be at the end organ leve or perhaps even at the subluxation level meaning that might be the pathway of the body eliminating its own subluxations,
        That is what your statement, at least to me, seemed to suggest
        Am I clear on this?

        • Joe Strauss 07/28/2014, 2:58 pm:

          No, I think you misunderstood what I wrote. A nerve impulse acts as a uf because due to the vs, the ii is no longer adapting it, changing its character, and “converting” it to an innate force (as Claude would say, the code making the uf into an if has been destroyed by the vs). An eif is a universal force. It may be adapted by the body. A nerve impulse is internally created (by the vs)acting as an eif. The sun is a universal force. If your skin adapts to it by producing sufficient melanin or it is not of sufficient magnitude, (a cloudy day), no damage/destruction of living cells occurs. If someone gives you a friendly slap on the back, the eif causes no subluxation. Your muscles as a result of irf adapt to it. If they give you an unfriendly slap on the back with a 2×4, the eif can cause a vs. A subluxation only occurs because the body fails to adapt to the uf. Is that clearer? Or does it create more questions? (More likely)

          • David Suskin 07/28/2014, 6:36 pm:

            Well, more questions? moi?
            Joe,
            What did you mean by:
            ‘ If that uf is not “converted” into an IF then the ii of the body must adapt to it’
            Is that adapting to a Subluxation (where uf are not converted to If or where If have been converted back to uf)??
            Or are you referencing something alse?

            What did you mean by that statement?

          • Joe Strauss 07/28/2014, 11:25 pm:

            David, if the uf is converted to an if, the body makes vit.D, or a nice tan-creates melanin or it is adapted to. If not it tends to be destructive toward structured matter. Sunburn and skin damage can occur. If a uf is adapted, an adjustment occurs. If not a VS or fracture can occur

          • David Suskin 07/29/2014, 1:01 am:

            Joe
            Yes! An adjustment occurs if it is adapted.
            Now I know we’re on the same wave length

            Amazing isn’t it 🙂

            No more questions till tomorrow.

    • David Suskin 01/08/2015, 3:11 pm:

      Joe? Claude? Steve?,
      p1-p5 presents the observation of the law of organization and deduces to the necessity of intelligence united to matter by force. This force is metaphysical, meaning there is no tangible, physical connection to matter, but it exists.
      With Life p18, we identify matter that is Living and IT’S intelligence (p20), we call Innate Intelligence. It has a mission and function (p21,23).
      We say that for every innate need there is an innate awareness and is available 100% (p22). This awareness does not require a physical connection, thus the discussions we’ve had dealing with the AFFERENT side of Innate CYCLES.
      Since elemental matter (p1), does not require a physical connection of intelligence to matter (the force is metaphysical), why is it that the Mental Impulse, that we have assigned to as the transmission of innate forces, requires a physical medium, or why do we ASSUME, or DEDUCE that it in fact does?
      I know we have p28 that states the NERVE is the carrier of this metaphysical impulse, but why do we postulate this FACT. Why don’t we postulate that Innate Intelligence exists, must exist (vitalism), and like the afferent (innate is aware of every innate need), it also is in connection with all living matter AND transmits it’s innate forces accordingly (eg. universal intelligence >> force >> e/matter). WHY or HOW is the NEED for the NERVE or some transmission vehicle deduced? Understand? 🙂

      • David Suskin 01/08/2015, 3:28 pm:

        I’m going to answer my own question. I’d still would greatly appreciate your comments.
        Because Existence of Matter is Always (matter cannot be destroyed or created). Its existence is maintained by ui thru force and that is forever (assumed).
        However Living Matter comes from other living matter, BUT LIVING MATTER DIES. The fact of death, because of LOM, indicates that there is a loss of connection between innate intelligence and matter. Unlike Universal matter, which is always effected by the law of Organization, there is a loss of Active Organization.
        How does that Happen? It deductively MUST happen Physically. Some connection is lost. We call that LOM. So it’s Matter we deduce carries the innate forces to innate matter and thus allows life to be maintained. If Life was not dependent on physical matter to transmit (in this case, the nerve), then Life WOULD LIVE FOREVER, and that IS NOT THE CASE. LOM implies a transmission vehicle for mental impulses.
        How did I do?

        • Claude 01/08/2015, 4:43 pm:

          David,

          Therefore, WHAT is the interface of innate forces and living e/matter?

          • David Suskin 01/08/2015, 5:19 pm:

            Hi Claude,
            1st of all, is my question pertinent? Is my answer on target?
            And to answer your question:
            a.? The mental impulse-living e/matter junction?
            b? The signs of Life?
            c? The inability to quantify/qualify metaphysical properties such as
            this interface
            d? LIFE
            I DON’T KNOW! HELP ME PROF. I think I’ve done so well up to this point, extrapolating life/death into the requirement of a physical medium to transmit the mental impulse.
            GIVE ME A LITTLE POOSH. Se il vous plaît!!!!!!

          • David Suskin 01/08/2015, 9:30 pm:

            Claude,
            Taken from ‘Innate Thots’ http://chiropracticoutsidethebox.com/2014/07/18/force/#comment-20325
            I believe your answer, is in there (see below the ******) My interpretation is as follows:
            The interface is where there is motion, p14,15 at the elemental level
            with organic matter, living matter. Instructive mental impulse (innate forces) transmit within living matter (nerves), and interface at the elemental level, adapting universal forces so the parts can have coordinated action and mutual benefit
            *****************************
            WHAT we don’t see is what Joseph calls “the coded message”. We will never see that! It’s purely metaphysical. So, before the activity of educated brain, which is the expression of instructive information from the law of active organization of e/matter, in MOTION, mental impulses are decoded by the specific innate intelligence of the organ to produce its product. Liver produces bile, pancreas produces insulin and educated brain produces thoughts. You cannot see the bile until the liver reveals it to you. You cannot see the insulin until the pancreas reveals it to you. You cannot see the thought until the educated brain reveals it to you. All can be seen as instructive information MANIFESTED by MOTION of specific e/matter. By the way, the law of organization and the law of active organization CANNOT evolve being ALWAYS 100% perfect (pri.7). –

            – Once again the interface between law of organization or law of active organization and e/matter is instructive information (pri.10). –

            – Therefore, it is we WHO can choose to relate the concept from the point of view of intelligence (ALL ONE) or from the point of view of e/matter (living things and non-living things). Either one works as long as we do not MIX them together. It’s a hierarchy of complexities depending upon the configuration and velocity of electrons, protons and neutrons of e/matter instructed by intelligence.

  2. David Suskin 07/19/2014, 6:34 pm:

    Joe
    Amazing and certainly projects a sense of optimism and confidence in the Life process versus the darkness that disease projects, a major contrast perceptually in Adio vs oibu viewpoints.

    This ‘wish’ of innate, that travels the nerve impulse, that transforms into a mental impulse, it’s a coded metaphysical message, but it still exists in terms of neurological physicality? Correct?

    So it’s a biological representation of the intent or wish of ii. So it would be measurable? Yes,no? But maybe not understandable?

    It’s intent is to coordinate the physical, universal, so it promotes constructive and Life signs. The UI behavior of all matter is to deconstruct so without it. The mental impulse that is, the intelligent design of all these functioning transporting molecular controlling ion exchanging what would seem to be complete almost life processing functions. WOULD STOP WORKING CONSTRUCTIVELY and break down deconstruct, DiE!!!!!!

    I guess what I’m getting at is how close the matter is to fulfilling the living processes. Ultimately it’s protein shape change, membrane permeability, oxidation, ATP synthesis, mobility of DNA and RNA replication and generation of proteins to create chemistries to perform physical function. A GRAND MACHINE intelligently designed I presume by ii and requiring ii to pull the switch and maintain it in active organization and coordination. Otherwise the tendency will be DECONSTRUCTION. Thermodynamic stability. DEATH

    YES/NO?

    I’m stating this because when you look deeper and deeper into the mechanisms of life, it would seem that LIving organisms are indeed infinitely complex machinery that would almost seem that it could run itself except for the fact that philosophically it disproves.

    I see, and I’ve brought this up before, that the fact of consciousness existing in living things, particularly humans, really makes the f
    Distinction between what is living as a machine plus ii (life) and what isn’t (chemistry, dead cells, etc. )

    Certainly while we say that living things vs their corpse are similar materially but one is minus life. Yes but the corpse is minus ATP and other chemistries that have been abandoned or changed , so matter for matter they are not really the same. Matter for matter. Charge for charge.

    Any comments joe. On my pedantic verbose hyper slightly doubtful and negative hyperbole?

    I am serious about these rantinga and not playing devils advocate. I just want to believe and understand 100%. Also OIBU has from what I can see effected me and I’m sure many many many people.

    Trying to walk the walk. Talk the talk
    Appreciatively
    Dave

  3. David Suskin 07/19/2014, 7:03 pm:

    Joe, I hate to keep adding on to my replies. BUT
    If I didn’t stress it enough in my previously reply,
    The Deign And functionality of the design, would appear self evidently that is completely INTELLIGENT, but the process or moment to moment operation? Why do we or how do we know that THAT is ii?

    So I’m going back to the INTELLIGENT DESIGN being an ii designed, triune and all. But how do we assign ii to its live actions.

    The triune in inert matter exists. Couldn’t the ii triune exist in the building of life functions? But the actual starting of the machine and all of its signs of life rally be an incompressible mechanism

    And again please excuse my running on and on and on with this.
    It’s how I Leann, to walk mad talk 🙂

    • Joe Strauss 07/19/2014, 9:19 pm:

      Dave, not sure I really understand your question. But perhaps an analogy will help. Let’s look at ii as the law of life-Palmer’s term. By analogy the government in my town has a “stop and go” law, intelligently created (okay maybe the analogy has to be stretched a little here). Does it matter whether the law is being expressed by a cop on the corner holding up his hand and waving his arm or a traffic light? The theologian would say that God is the cop. The mechanist would say the traffic light is the mechanism, and that it (the light) created itself. The chiropractor would say that it doesn’t really matter, both are a reflection of the intelligently created law and should be obeyed. Chiropractic doesn’t pretend to know who created the law, who designed the traffic light or who erected it. I don’t even know who the cop is (only lived in this town a little over a year). I do know that life will be better if I live by the law. Does that help or make it more confusing? By the way you are up to 173 approved comments, which puts you only 5th on the all-time list (since stats were first kept in 2011) so keep on posting.

  4. David Suskin 07/20/2014, 1:24 am:

    Joe,
    Well I am determined and if you and all, help me to help myself, and I help you with a little checking, then we’re all doing fine.

    My question I think at its heart is questioning chiropractic vitalism with a triune versus intelligent design as a deism. It would seem that ii functions two fold
    1 in the design – which taken down to the molecule,while chemical and mechanical has obviously been created intelligently and claimed to be via ii
    2 in the moment to moment maintenance of organization and coordination, which is deduced to again be ii directed

    Both are products of ii. 1 is seeming intelligently operative, could be alive, not by the triune definition, but by observation perhaps. All the chemistry and actions of the proteins and messaging is physical and would appear to have LIFE potential. But perhaps that’s it. POTENTIAL but not Life,

    2. Is ii in action. The code that drives the intelligent mechanism.

    I guess what I’m saying is where does the mechanism stop and the LIFE, the law of life begin, deductively, and physically

    Don’t know if I’m just repeating myself. There is a question in here someplace.

    If intelligence is in the design and matter is just that. The matter that is designed to function within intelligent chemical functioning processes, then where does the force come in, if at all.

    Deism vs vitalism? A bit of a confusion to which one innate intelligence MUST belong to?

  5. David Suskin 07/20/2014, 10:57 am:

    Joe
    I’m reading in your book conflicts of philosophies page 98 this foundational institution with its manifestations of digestion growth reproduction and adaptation existed before the creation of any living organism for there could be no organism no organization of living things without this innate intelligence.

    Maybe what you’re saying is that a innate intelligence does the designing, and creates life and intelligence does live moment to moment and Innate intelligence has everything to do with anything that is allowed to live. All the chemistries, all the physical matter everything put together to allow life to happen, through mechanics through chemical reaction through protein synthesis through anything we can discover under a microscope it is a life force that allows the construction and the continued function and processed allowing life to happen with the signs of life present.

    Yes/ no

    • Claude 07/21/2014, 4:59 pm:

      Dave,

      That’s WHY innate intelligence IS the LAW of ACTive organization. Innate intelligence simply ACTS (pri.23) perfectly ALL of the time, “moment to moment” (pri.21). The LAW of ACTive organization ALWAYS acts without breaking a universal law (pri.24). From these principles, we deduce that Innate intelligence is normal and its function is ALWAYS normal (pri.27).

  6. David Suskin 08/24/2014, 9:21 pm:

    Clarification:
    It is my understanding that
    Intelligence is metaphysical, that
    Force is metaphysical and that
    Matter is physical.
    So, when we speak of universal forces (eg. Gravity) or innate forces (mental impulse), that the movement of, and/or expression in matter that we identify as change in distance or form or process or position is already at the Energy level, which is the matter level, meaning when we say an adjustment begins as an educated universal force, what we really mean is its a force(metaphysical) acting on energy creation which acts on matter(the spinal column)

    Chiropractic lexicon defines force ad metaphysical
    Any action or activity that takes place due to that force(information)/metaphysical, is an Energy manifestation that is influcneced by the intelligence/force metaphysicality
    Yes/no?

  7. David Suskin 09/11/2014, 4:24 pm:

    Question:
    Are all forces within the body innate forces, meaning,
    forces that are generated from chemistries or interacting forces in chemistries, are ALL innate forces withing the body OR TAMED UNIVERSAL FORCES or
    are chemistries manifesting UNIVERSAL FORCES, interacting, but at some point they must be converted, or tamed, by Innate Force, wherever Innate Force is generated from (Mental Impulse Transmitted over the nervous system to tissue cell, etc.)
    Claude?
    Joe?
    Steve?
    Anyone?
    You see where I’m coming from, if you’ve been reading these posts (Involvement with Chemistry of Life and relating that back to Innate Force)
    Answer__________? 😉 (shyly)

  8. David Suskin 11/24/2014, 12:30 am:

    Does innate intelligence/innate force in that they serve each organism ONLY, imply uniqueness in all life, or is it the variation of the matter component within each organism (let’s call it the snowflake phenomenon) of the triune that implies uniqueness, which in essence is a combination of the normalcy of innate intelligence joined to a unique matter?
    Are we all unique, to be honored from the existence of the normalcy and perfection of innate? As a deduction from the major premise, from the authority of the 33? Or am I going outside the authority and venturing into perhaps theological issues?
    Or is this questioning part of MY TRANSFORMATION?
    I ask because my dialogue with my pm’s tends to identify them as unique and special, as a a part of the implications of the authority of the 33 principles. Maybe this is part of the experience of being a principled chiropractor, seeing our pm’s as maximum expressions of innate intelligence which is something that they alone, as we too alone, own our own unique, normal, perfect version of?

    • Claude Lessard 11/24/2014, 2:16 am:

      David,

      Your genes are part of what makes you the person you are. You are different from everyone alive now and everyone who has ever lived. Your DNA is unique, separate and distinct from everyone else. Therefore, it is “the variation of the matter component within each organism (let’s call it the snowflake phenomenon) of the triune that implies uniqueness, which in essence is a combination of the normalcy of innate intelligence joined to a unique matter” as you wrote above. The law of ACTIVE organization, the innate intelligence of the body, is the same within EVERYONE, pretty much like the law of gravity is the same for everyone on planet earth. It is e/matter that is unique. For example, pro cliff skier, Jamie Pierre, is known to be able to practice his sport by jumping off the roof of his house. He holds the world record of 255 foot cliff jump, in Wyoming in 2006. Well, if it is me WHO were to choose to jump off the roof of my house, I would wind up in the emergency ward with some fractures and perhaps worse. Yet, that is how Jamie Pierre practices to keep in shape in the summer. Same 100% innate intelligence (pri22) for Jamie Pierre than you and I… yet his unique e/matter (DNA) allows him to do that. Ukrainian Lubomyr Melnyk plays at a dizzying 19.5 piano notes per second, same innate intelligence, than you and I, 100% proportional to the organization of living e/matter. (pri22). Innate intelligence is metaphysical and its mission is to maintains the material of the body of “any” living thing in ACTIVE organization (pri21) through its function (pri23) and is ALWAYS normal (pri27) and ALWAYS 100% (pri22). –

      – Therefore, together without condemnation, we can conclude that it is the UNIQUE configuration and velocity of electrons, protons and neutrons of e/matter, which are the properties and action given to e/matter by universal intelligence, that makes ALL e/matter UNIQUE (pri1) including “living e/matter” (pri21).

    • Joe Strauss 11/24/2014, 10:42 am:

      David, Claude’s response (above) seems to me to be in disagreement with B.J. who apparently maintained through much of his writings that the difference between geniuses and the rest of us is the limitation of the transmitting matter due to vertebral subluxation rather than the limitation of genetic matter. He wrote at times, intimating that we could all be an Einstein or Mozart, if the innate intelligence of the body could be fully expressed. For what it is worth, I tend to agree with Claude, not B.J., on this one. But then, I have to live with Claude (at least on this blog), B.J. never seems to post. Lest Claude get an inflated ego, I’m not convinced of the correctness of the last paragraph of his comment/post.

      • Claude 11/24/2014, 3:28 pm:

        Joseph,

        That last paragraph is based on the major premise… in ALL e/matter (including individual DNA)… giving to it ALL properties and actions. If it is a “living thing”, it is maintained in Active organization (alive) by innate intelligence (pri.21). What’s your input?

  9. Steve 11/24/2014, 5:44 pm:

    I researched genetics, DNA, and inherited in the GB. It seems BJ spoke mostly to inherited diseases. I wonder how much was known about DNA in BJ’s time?
    Question 257. Does Chiropractic accept the theory of genetics, i.e.,
    color of eyes and hair, body build, baldness, character traits, etc.?
    Answer 257. We take stock in stock, that matter reproduces matter
    of like kind—color of eyes and hair, general body build, height, etc.,
    but not in baldness or character traits, as these are symptoms of
    dis-ease. Vol 24
    Chiropractic holds that dis-ease cannot be inherited because it
    is not a value but a lack of value. Vol 27
    Without the subluxations that lower his tissue resistance in
    that particular respect, he will never have the dis-ease which is said
    to be inherited. Vol 27
    Art. 338. EVOLUTION VALUES.
    A series of similar adaptations repeated a number of times
    results in a change of shape and texture of a tissue.
    If there is a failure of such adaptations there will be no
    adaptive improvements in the tissue. The failure is due to
    interference with transmission.
    If no need arises calling for adaptive improvement, such
    changes will not be made and the specie settles into a type.
    If there is not a constant use of the adaptive improvements of
    tissue, it will be removed or reduced to the rudimentary, by
    Innate.
    If the change in tissue, due to successful adaptation, becomes
    permanent through use, it will be transmitted to posterity.
    If the descendants continue to use improvements which were
    inherited, they become permanently established as property of
    the race.
    The unsuccessful adaptations are not transmitted to posterity
    for in that case there are no values to transmit.
    Dis-ease is a failure to adapt, therefore is not inherited. Vol 27

    • Claude Lessard 11/24/2014, 7:45 pm:

      Steve,

      Which principles is BJ using to back up his statements that you quoted? “We take stock in stock, that matter reproduces matter of like kind—color of eyes and hair, general body build, height, etc.,but not in baldness or character traits, as these are symptoms of dis-ease”. Symptoms of DIS-EASE? What is that exactly according to the 33 principles? For you to quote BJ like this, you must see something valuable to this thread. What is it Steve?

  10. Steve 11/24/2014, 9:01 pm:

    The symptom(s) of dis-ease is (are) discoordination. As BJ said a lack of value. Pri 30
    Joe said BJ did not include genetics in his analysis, I contend that little was know of genetics in BJ’s day. So to him it was all about innate expression, or the lack thereof.

    • Claude 11/24/2014, 9:35 pm:

      Steve,

      Are you saying that BJ thought that the symptoms of baldness and character traits have no value? High blood pressure, headaches and all the many symptoms manifested in the human body? I don’t see the word symptoms or diseases or illness, or syndromes in any of the 33 principles of chiropractic’s basic science… Do you?

      • Claude 11/24/2014, 10:00 pm:

        … in other words, Steve, as Joseph mentioned above, do you think that if BJ were to post on this blog TODAY in 2014, that he would have posted what YOU chose to post in order to refine and clarify? I don’t think so. BJ would be way ahead of ALL of us TODAY and could probably teach us quite a bit. Re-read what you posted in view of the information of TODAY. Your contention is absolutely CORRECT and TRUE, “that little was know of genetics in BJ’s day”. Therefore, WHY bringing up the horse and buggy, that was a necessary step of the past, to “clarify” a 2015 Porsche Cayenne GTS ? 😉

        • Steve 11/24/2014, 11:12 pm:

          No, I think BJ was saying we do not inherit disease because we do not pass on dis-ease to our offspring. Around the quotes he expressed an idea that II and IF brought value to matter. Dis-ease therefore was a lack of value and not a genetic trait.
          Jamie Pierre did not inherit that bone density he developed it just as you or I could. His innate intelligence adapted force and matter to withstand tremendous impact over time, his bones evolved. The question to follow would be, do his kids have extraordinary bone density.
          Lubomyr Melnyk has the same bones and muscles you do but he has developed them exquisitely, this is not a genetic difference, but an environmental one.
          Today we consider genetics as one factor of LOM. Some have hypothesized that several generations under chiropractic care could improve genetics but as far as I know this is yet unproven.
          Although, as you say, innate intelligence is the same for all, it’s expression is individual.

          • Claude 11/25/2014, 12:31 am:

            Steve,

            The is no such thing as “his innate”. Innate intelligence is a law. Do you say: “His gravity” allows him to jump the cliffs”? Individual expression is about principles 13, 21 and 23. It’s about the function of e/matter. This is NOT “as I say”… It is WHAT the AUTHORITY of the 33principles of chiropractic’s basic science say! It’s very important to understand that!

          • Steve 11/25/2014, 5:07 pm:

            I don’t know Claude, DD said innate intelligence was an individualized portion of universal intelligence…The universe is composed of matter and intelligence; the former is acted
            upon by the latter. All impulses of the planetary system and the animals
            which inhabit it, are directed by this universal intelligence which is
            individualized according to their needs. From this universal intelligence
            individualized, call it what you like, originate impulses which in the veret-brata
            are transmitted thru the nervous system. DD 1910.
            Truly your innate and mine are not the same, yours is ideal for your body, mine is for mine.Pri.22
            Gravity being a UF is the same for all, agreed?

  11. David Suskin 11/25/2014, 12:15 am:

    In Joes opening statement:
    ‘The purpose is determined by the appliance (physical matter) receiving it. Innate force is always different in that its purpose is not determined by the appliance (organ or part of the body) but by the intelligence creating it. That’s the difference between a mechanistic viewpoint and a vitalistic one.’
    Doesn’t this statement imply that individuality comes from intelligence, whether ii or ui, and being that it is intelligence that maintains matter in existence or (active organization-living existence), matter imposes individuality more by its limiting factors upon the expression of ii.
    We all share perhaps a common origin of ii but with regards to the creation of force, that is individualized by LOM, by p7 and by the intelligences intent to adapt universal forces.
    Yes. It would seem I’m circular reasoning here perhaps. You, Claude have made reference to the unidirectional nature of Adio, suggesting that all intent, all purpose, all creations go forth from the origins of universal intelligence.
    Yet once again, Joe began this post saying NO to intelligence operating as matter based. That would be mechanistic!
    I did bring up the fact that it was LOM within a triune existence which implicates the existence of life, of imperfection of p5
    Come on, come on, clarify this enigma!

  12. David Suskin 11/25/2014, 1:24 am:

    Ok ok. Words have meanings.
    Innate’s (intelligence and force) PURPOSE is NOT determined by matter. (It’s active organization)
    It being expressed by matter is a unique manifestation by virtue of matters individuality.
    That’s why we are brothers and sisters to the Law of Innate intelligence.
    But then again, mono directionality of Adio and mans free will and life’s immeasurable invisible metaphysical innate intelligence and as you say Claude universal intelligence creating force that maintains matter in existence leaves a mystery that cannot assume that each individual expression of intelligence is not a unique phenomenon as expressed within the properties and actions of matter, non living and living.

  13. David Suskin 11/25/2014, 5:29 pm:

    Joe,
    I’ve been thinking and
    I’d like to address this again. (as stated above).
    Your initial posting:
    …The purpose is determined by the appliance (physical matter) receiving it. Innate force is always different in that its purpose is not determined by the appliance (organ or part of the body) but by the intelligence creating it. That’s the difference between a mechanistic viewpoint and a vitalistic one…
    to my way of thinking, seems to be at odds with
    how intelligence by virtue of cause and effect operates.
    If intelligence acts in accordance WITHOUT taking into account what matter it is directed to, then how can it address the organization (for example), or the active organization that it is trying to in the end express?
    Yet I know we’re talking about intelligence and that intelligence might KNOW all but it’s forces might need to be implemented, I don’t know, Generically or Specifically as per the matter it is addressing.
    If ui and/or ii functions to create force or adapt force, by your post it would seem that it is a generic operation, unless implicit in the operation of intelligence is its END result.
    It perhaps KNOWS Matter. It KNOWS the result of active organization and thus creates forces that can render matter with it’s properties and actions, or adapted constructively to promote it’s LIVING Missions and Functions.
    On one level it would seem that intelligence is for ALL and Matter is specific, thus Matter determines identity and uniqueness. On another level it would seem that INTELLIGENCE KNOWS ALL, is a one way ADIO direction (as per Claude’s reference to OIBU really doesn’t exist as an entity, like darkness not being an entity, etc.), and therefore identity and uniqueness might be a condition of matter, it TOO, might be a condition, I’m suggesting, of Intelligence. Yes, Gravity is not MY gravity, but then again, without me, gravity has no effect on me. It’s kind of a catch 22, yes, no?
    We define things, like Intelligence, but sometimes our definitions do not, CANNOT completely define or illuminate.
    Yes, I know. 33 principles is enough, Period. But there’s gotta be some meat, something to sink your teeth into, that lasts and definitions need to be explored and fully explored and comprehended, True!, for one individual, like ME, to GET THE BIG IDEA.
    Ok, I’m a Meat Head

  14. Claude Lessard 11/25/2014, 6:52 pm:

    Steve,

    You posted: …” directed by this universal intelligence which is
    individualized according to their needs”. That is not what principle #22 states. There is 100% of METAphysical innate intelligence in a “living thing” (it is either 100% complete in EVERY living thing or 0% in EVERY non-living things). You cannot separate innate intelligence, it is present or it is absent. Innate intelligence will indeed maintain ALL living things in ACTIVE organization (alive) (pri21) supplying the needs of ALL living things (pri23) according to LOM (pri24). –

    – I understand the inconsistency of DD’s statement “individualized portion of universal intelligence”. Yet… according to the AUTHORITY of the 33 principles of chiropractic’s basic science, specifically principles #20, 21, 22 and 23, innate intelligence is METAphysical and is ALWAYS complete 100%. It is e/matter that is different, due to the configuration and velocity of its electrons, protons and neutrons, including the DNA. Then, it is through the principle of coordination (pri32) that the law of “demand and supply” (pri33) is operative. –

    – Another inconsistency also happens with electrons, protons and neutrons. Due to Heisenberg’s uncertain principle, it now believed that the electron, for example, does not simultaneously bear definite location and velocity. Since there are experimental limitations of instruments of measurement, there is an unavoidable interference of the system of measurement upon the measured entity. Thus the theoretical statement of the uncertainty principle: “The degree of uncertainty of the electron’s position is inversely proportional to the uncertainty of its velocity, or momentum. Thus, precise knowledge of those 2 properties at one time is even theoretically UNFEASIBLE! –

    – As Einstein commented to Heisenberg: “But on principle, it is quite wrong to try founding a theory on observable magnitudes alone. In reality the very opposite happens. It is the theory which decides what we can observe” (cited in Werner Heisenberg, Physics and Beyond: Encounters and Conversations, p.63.) This means, that we needed DD’s insights of 1910, so that BJ and RWS could enunciate the 33 principles of chiropractic’s basic science. 😉

  15. David Suskin 11/25/2014, 7:51 pm:

    Claude,
    As stated,
    …due to the configuration and velocity of its electrons, protons and neutrons…
    Is not this configuration dependent on Both the ui that configures AND the matter which possesses the electrons, protons and neutrons, etc. that is being configured within an uncertainty principle, which IS the theory that IS being decided upon to make an observation.
    Since P1 is based on an induction using observation, does not this then render the 33 principles too, an Authority that IS within that same Uncertainty Principle?

    • Claude 11/25/2014, 8:32 pm:

      David,

      That is the paradox of concepts. 😉

  16. David Suskin 11/25/2014, 8:38 pm:

    Thus many mornings I wake up as a cockroach but the day typically whips me into shape to
    Carry On ADIO 🙂

  17. John 11/26/2014, 6:46 pm:

    OK, here is a good one,, force, what is force ???? you already put intention behind the TONE or FREQUENCY and made it mechanical……TONE or FREQUENCY are just nature, everything in ONE …it is a WAVE and it is either free to express itself and carry the information and experience through space or it is stuck in a limited environment that contains it……I believe that dis-ease is when waves get trapped, maybe to the point of stagnation and having proper structure allows those waves to be there as long as needed picking up and dropping off and thing being allowed to do what it was set out to do and stay or leave for reasons that are beyond our comprehension some times……..Chiropractic – Founded on TONE, right, that is what the cover page in THE BOOK says ????? get back to basics forget universal and innate……they are WAVES and their free resonance in any situation determines its TONE because it vibrates at a certain FREQUENCE so it will have HARMONY or not …..if it is FORCED is that truly HARMONY ?????? if the peg not fit don’t use the hammer Baby Huey keep trying shapes until you get the one that fits, the one that HARMONIZES so you don’t have FORCE….. does that make sense………Now if you are the Chiropractor and there is a “SUB-LUX-ATION” well then you might have to put a FREQUENCY along the Joint Plan Line or on a proximal line to resolve the FORCES so the body can HARMONIZE ….. I mean FORCE to me is where harmony doesn’t exist and the frequency the Chiropractor provides can apparently soft-hard-fast- slow I am not judging as long as it resolves the conflict that causes the FORCE…….i am not a BJ or 33 principle guy so I hope this makes sense to you, Peace

  18. John 11/26/2014, 7:08 pm:

    PS TONE is a RESONANCE of a wave HARMONY that is self contained and creates a unique quality that has effect . it can apparently fluctuate, stay stable and HARMONIZE or not with its environment…. in law the RES is the body or object being considered, the RES of the trust …..Res being short for RESONANCE …..it can be a RIGHT or intellectual property or annuity having no physical presence or it can be a car or house or living being…….Chiropractors some times think like these things only happen on a certain level, TONE – RESONANCE – HARMONY – FORCE, these are the waves that make up every part of our life experience…..to me FORCE is used in medicine and is used to control nature of WAVES which can cause unwanted reactions to the conscious…….and what might be conscious is anything with a VIBRATION because you change a VIBRATING state….. does that make sense……..I am trying to be very basic here…….

    • Claude Lessard 11/26/2014, 9:55 pm:

      John,

      Good to have you post on COTB. Welcome. Please, read some of the past threads and you will find that the nature a FORCE was discussed and refined at length. It will most certainly clarify some of your very valid questions and also further your inquiry.

  19. David Suskin 04/19/2015, 7:00 pm:

    Yes, I do realize I can be redundant, but then again, that’s what LEARNING requires.
    In all my readings, whether RWS, Reggie, even as recently as Koch, the term force was this hybrid term, consisting of energy/and information, until more recently, where force was, is as understood in 2015, as a metaphysical creation of a metaphisical intelligence.
    Am I correct? Is this still a debate (force being both physical-energy + intelligent information! or JUST THE INFORMATION imparted into the NOW POPULAR TERM, e/matter?
    When, without condemnation, did it become more precisely defined?
    And are we all, in OSC, in agreement?

  20. David Suskin 05/10/2015, 1:32 pm:

    Question:
    Are all innate forces, mental impulses?

    • Joe Strauss 05/11/2015, 1:40 pm:

      David, I think we should also ask the converse of that question: are all mental impulses, innate forces?

      • David Suskin 05/12/2015, 6:39 pm:

        Let me try again.
        1. Are all innate forces mental impulses (forces)?
        2. Are all mental impulses (forces) innate forces?
        #2 my thoughts are yes.
        #1 I DO NOT KNOW. (see above)

        • Claude 05/13/2015, 2:59 pm:

          The innate intelligence of the body adapts universal forces (pri23) and they become innate forces. In the living human body, if those innate forces are for coordination of action (pri23 and 32), they are mental impulses and can be interfered with their transmissions (pri29) which are always directly or indirectly due to VS (pri31). –

          – If VS is present, the mental impulse (innate force) which is constructive is reverted back to a nerve impulse (universal force) which is deconstructive, causing the tissue cell to lack coordination of action for the benefit of the whole. At that moment, the innate intelligence of the tissue cell will adapt (or not) the universal force into an innate force causing the tissue cell to be working only for its survival at the expense of the whole and not for the coordination of actions of the whole. That tissue cell is said to be “cellfish”. The innate forces of the tissue cell are NOT mental impulses, since their instructive information are NOT for coordination of actions of ALL parts of the body for MUTUAL benefit of the WHOLE. The original intended instructive information for that tissue cell for the benefit of the WHOLE has been re-coded as a “cellfish” state only to keep that cell alive (pri 21)… in order to rely on time for an EUF (external universal force) to be adapted into an innate force, by the innate intelligence of the body, for the correction of the VS. All of this process occurs within the limitation of e/matter. –

          – On the other hand, ALL mental impulses are innate forces due to the normality of the function of the innate intelligence of the body (pri27) being transmitted through the nerve system (pri28) for harmonious actions of all the parts of the body (pri32). –

          • David Suskin 05/13/2015, 5:14 pm:

            Ok. Thank you for that reply.
            So we have a subluxation(s)
            Essentially the subluxation exists because of a disturbed, lack of, interfered with, vertemere. The unit of vertebral control.
            The vertemere possesses universal forces, cellfish cells( probably muscle, nerve, ligamentous, etc. )
            The issue is that these cellfish supportive, non-coordinating cells, serve themselves, NOT the restoration of the subluxation until an EIF is rendered so that the vertemere can use that force, removing dis-ease from the vertemere, allowing the subluxation correction.
            Because of LOM, recidivism is prone to occur perhaps till enough healing or health has been restored to the vertemere or because of LOM and confused stresses occurred in living, the subluxation, the altered vertemere expression of ii returns. Therefore time, LOM, determine the possibility of lifetime LACVS for the fullest expression of ii.
            Is this a local, regional, path of the demise of innate forces and the possibility of their restoration?

          • David Suskin 05/14/2015, 12:23 am:

            Claude,
            I do keep returning to this point, I know, but I think it is good to clarify.
            You state that …the innate intelligence of the tissue cell will adapt (or not) the universal force into an innate force causing the tissue cell to be working only for its survival at the expense of the whole and not for the coordination of actions of the whole. …
            If I am to understand this crucial point accurately, cells, organs, etc. have chemical interactions with each other (particularly hormones, enzymes, etc. ). These are PHYSICAL interactions. They are FUNDAMENTAL physiological feedback interactions that the PHYSICAL parts of the body interact to, run with, build with, etc.
            In a way they are the intelligent design aspect of the body’s parts interactions.
            However, this IS NOT the same as COORDINATION OF ACTIONS OF ALL PARTS OF THE BODY FOR MUTUAL BENEFIT.
            Innate Intelligence serves to take Physical function and turn it to Metaphysical interaction. The former is deconstructive by nature, and the latter is constructive and MOST IMPORTANTLY ADAPTIVE.
            Yes, the cells of the body, make up organized tissues, called organs.
            They interact to allow body function to take place, but for the signs of life to be maintained, and for p21 and p23 and p32 to render their principles, a centralized coordinator called the nervous system, must bear a mental impulse to allow the triune to manifest as life, a bonding of immaterial and material realms, or objects.
            Innate forces emanate within job specific cells, but an innate intelligence as dictated as a part of a complete organism, as expressed thru the combining innate forces of the matter of the body exists to serve the WHOLE, which requires the deductive model as revealed thru the 33 principles of chiropractic.
            Am I talking in circles? I hope not. I am trying to distinguish between what would seem to be the intelligently formed and functioning body, chemically, >> AND an innately directed existence of what we call LIFE, as directed from intelligence to force to matter, THE LAW OF LIFE expressing the chiropractic meaning of life

          • Claude 05/14/2015, 1:07 pm:

            … in other words, VS interferes with TRANSMISSION which causes DIS-EASE of the TRANSMITTING matter which decodes the mental impulse (innate force constructive) into a nerve impulse (universal force deconstructive). When the nerve impulse (universal force deconstructive) is received by the tissue cell, the innate intelligence of the cell may or may not adapt that universal force (due to LOM). If the innate intelligence of the cell does adapt it, this universal force will be ONLY re-coded into an innate force for the survival of the cell, which becomes “cellfish”. In time if that “cellfish” lives long enough until the VS is corrected by the innate intelligence of the body, and the mental impulse reaches that cell, it will have coordination of actions for mutual benefit of the WHOLE… in time. The Principle Of Coordination (pri32) will once again be manifested by the living body through coordinated motion (pri14). –

            – This is also an illustration of the limitation of e/matter (pri24) and TIME. 😉

  21. David Suskin 05/11/2015, 2:11 pm:

    Joe,
    I purposely did not ask that question (my take), because, Yes, as we define it, All mental impulses Have to be or at least comprise innate forces, metaphysical innate forces.
    My question was generated because I associate mental impulse with the creation of those forces that we have designated as innate intelligences way of using the nervous system as a coordinator and converter of universal forces into innate forces thru it’s, here’s the thing, transmission of mental forces (innate forces)??? So that became confusing to me. Kind of a circular reasoning.
    Innate forces to transmitted as mental impulses from brain to tissue cell, to do what??? adapt universal forces to innate forces??? And when we adjust someone, and the organism (human being), takes that eif (educated universal force)-invasive, and innate intelligence, converts it to innate force and uses it to adjust it’s own subluxation??
    Anyway enough of me. I did ask the question, for a reason.
    But that’s my babbling din, on this one. 🙂

    • David Suskin 05/14/2015, 7:55 pm:

      Claude,
      As per
      “Claude 05/14/2015, 1:07 pm:
      … If the innate intelligence of the cell does adapt it, this universal force will be ONLY re-coded into an innate force for the survival of the cell,…”
      AND THAT CELL HAS A FUNCTION. IT’S FUNCTION MIGHT BE INVOLVED WITH COORDINATED ACTIVITIES, LIKE DIGESTION (ASSIMILATION), EXCRETION, REPRODUCTION, ADAPTATION, GROWTH.
      So here we have a celfish cell, involved with PHYSICAL process that is within some kind of intelligent, operating pathway, BUT IS UN-COORDINATED, UN-ADAPTED FROM A Global, Metaphysical, Innate Intelligence Function and Mission Realm. I’m saying.
      Is that in error? Does that pose any confusion to an understanding of the 33 principles and how they present Metaphysical Function, Operation and Mission.
      Yes, I know I belabor this. Yes I know perhaps I DO NOT HAVE THE BIG IDEA. There seems to be an intelligent realm that presents itself physically, and an intelligent realm that presents itself metaphysically. One is by nature, desconstructive and perhaps one would say DEAD, Non-Adaptive IN WHOLE. The other is the umbrella of LIFE that allows for Adaptation of Physical forces to Innate Forces, which is required for this Organism, this Vertebrate Being to Maintain it’s existence in Active Organisation.
      I’m just going where my logic and without condemnation, inquiry takes me. Yes, it’s somewhat doubting. Yes it’s somewhat devils advocatish. Yes it’s perhaps MISSING THE POINT ENTIRELY!
      Without condemnation to this Man On a Mission, Continue provide your teaching, your patience, and your wisdom emparted, upon myself, beyond a ‘Go for it’, or ‘Just do it’ or ‘Suffer like the rest of us have’.
      I await your jewel 🙂

      • Claude Lessard 05/14/2015, 11:06 pm:

        David,

        I cannot give you the jewel you have within YOU. It’s yours! NOT mine. WHY is it that I “see” the jewel within you and you don’t? STOP fighting it and just go and tell the story over and over and over and over and over and over and over AGAIN until, like Joe D., you’re gonna be so tired of it, so SUFFERING, you wanna cry after doing it for 48 years! (that’s really what he said at the last GSCS convention last month). Do it DAVID! Don’t talk about it anymore… JUST DO IT!!! WHY is it you WHO choose Puddles’ Pity Party? All you need is to wake up David, yet you’re cozy in your bed and you don’t want to wake up, AND most important of all: YOU don’t even know that you don’t want to wake up!!! I’m not here to wake you up! That’s yours to do. I can barely keep myself from falling asleep.
        “I believe that people are here to grow THEMSELVES into best good that they can be – at least, this is what I want to do”. The Trane 😉

        • David Suskin 05/14/2015, 11:59 pm:

          Ah, Monsieur…
          That is genuine from the heart.
          Thank you Claude. 🙂

  22. Claude 05/14/2015, 12:45 am:

    David,
    Not quite. 😉 It’s not innate intelligence’s return. Innate intelligence is always present. It’s the innate FORCES of the innate intelligence of the body that return! And it’s the LACVS for the fullest expression of the innate FORCES of the innate intelligence of the body. Chiropractic Is SPECIFIC or it is nothing. If it is you WHO choose to own chiropractic, then it is you WHO will have to choose to be SPECIFIC! Yet, with ALL this philosophysing, it will NOT get you to go out there and DO it! It is you WHO has got choose to get into the trenches and SUFFER your LOM like everybody else. Y
    It is you WHO has got a lot of catching up to do… Just do it! Carry on. ADIO. 😉

  23. Claude 05/14/2015, 5:09 pm:

    David,

    Your problem is a result of your choosing to separate physical interACTION from metaphysical instructive information, be it constructive or deconstructive. ALWAYS remember the major premise: A (metaphysical) universal intelligence is in ALL e/matter…
    It is when you choose to look at interACTIONS from a mechanical view point that you get lost and confuse. Think dammit think! 😉

    • David Suskin 05/15/2015, 1:23 pm:

      Claude,
      This is per your reply:Claude 05/14/2015, 1:07 pm:
      Entertain this thought for a bit
      If you stuck a physical pump (artificial heart, that worked) inside someones chest, wouldn’t that be providing a:
      Claude 05/14/2015, 1:07 pm:
      … mutual benefit of the WHOLE…?
      So how would this PHYSICAL mutual benefit BE DIFFERENT than
      an Innate Force directed, METAPHYSICAL mutual benefit of the WHOLE?
      The physical level of our bodies ALSO provides an adaptive, assimilative, excretory, etc. functioning within a WHOLE Body.
      I understand that Innate Intelligence maintains Life, and constructive purpose, and adaptive to universal forces purpose, but the Matter too is organized, with it’s UNIVERSAL forces maintaining body matter in existence, to provide feedback, regulatory, adaptive functions.
      Man, The Chemical Machine!
      Celfish Cells still perform their regulatory functions, being that they RESPOND TO CHEMICAL STIMULATIONS, RESPONSES, ETC.
      They might be disconnected from a CENTRALIZING INNATE INTELLIGENCE, AND THAT MIGHT BE KEY, ALSO THAT THIS CENTRALIZING STRUCTURE IS A CELL-TISSUE-SYSTEM CALLED THE NERVOUS SYSTEM THAT BASICALLY IS YOUR LIFE. When the nervous system is dead, You are Dead!
      The metaphysical ii provides the forces to all the body, organism, life, which includes sustaining the cells and handling the cells. The cells do functions for the sustaining and coordination of the body (chemically). This IS a Physical Function.
      I’m still stuck on the BIG CONFUSION 🙂
      I AM MISSING SOMETHING HERE. I’M THINKING. but I’m missing something.
      When an UNSUBLUXATED CHILD DIES, HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN THAT?

  24. David Suskin 05/14/2015, 5:54 pm:

    Claude,
    I’m thinkin, I’m thinkin 😉
    But Reality. Physical Reality.
    The 99% prominent THING in this world, that is sought after is either entertainment based, expression based (creative), doing based (club, exercise, playing cards, whatever), power based (money or attractiveness, ego, etc.) or LOM based (MEDICINE).
    The world is SUFFERING.
    Medicine offers a handling of this suffering, evaluating for 3000 diseases and counting, with highly educated specialists to use more and more advanced technology to render a result. It’s HUGE. And it’s the vocabulary of EVERYONE, unless you’re a monk living above the clouds. Mankind is SICK. I don’t know if that means disease is the absence of health, or Health is the absence of disease, but Mankind IS Sick. And it’s a big business. AND CHIROPRACTIC HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT AND NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!
    Listen. I’ve had my share. You might have had YOUR share. Many people, if not all, have had their share, of HeartAche perhaps, of Pain, of Suffering. It’s Mankind.
    NOW CHIROPRACTIC CASTS THIS HUGE NET OF POSSIBILITY OVER ALL OF THIS.
    A HUGE METAPHYSICAL NET ENCOMPASSING INTELLIGENCE, PURPOSE, POTENTIAL, OPTIMAL EXPRESSION. A Healthy, Healing Humanity.
    It’s a whole other MINDSET this ADIO vs the MORE popular OIBU.
    This is what I’m stuck in. My past experiences. Like everyone, anyone else. Maybe even you Claude (to some extent).
    This is what causes my vacillation. Thinking that Reason PLUS WISE Perception, OWNING IT, will Transform me.
    I’m not unique in this quagmire. I know it!
    You even said it.
    David
    “It is you WHO has got choose to get into the trenches and SUFFER your LOM like everybody else. Y
    It is you WHO has got a lot of catching up to do…”
    I don’t want to SUFFER anymore. Catching up? For Who? Me? The public? Who?
    Back and forth, back and forth.
    And here’s the thing, and I hope you’re still reading.
    I go, to my JOB (not Chiropractic), and I’M MISERABLE! Wasting my life, in a employee-employer relationship that is Outdated, Bad Vibed, Boring and Unsupportive, NO GROWTH, BUT FEELING TRAPPED! Yet, when I was practicing Traditional/Mixer Chiropractic for 20 years, Eventually I became Miserable. You know the story. I’ve only pined and wallowed about it a zillion times. But I’m honest. I’m a soul searcher, a truth seeker and will continue to search and seek till my last breath (maybe beyond – there’s metaphysical 🙂
    I’M JUST TRYING TO PUT TOGETHER ALL OF THE STOPS, REMOVE ALL OF THE STOPS, or at least figure out why I’m stopping and STOP STOPPING!!!! DAMMIT 🙂
    any thoughts my ‘getting impatient colleague-hope not’?
    I really do appreciate you’re commitment and responses.
    I, as you can see, feel at least (not a good indicator of truth I know), STUCK BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARD PLACE, metaphysically at least 🙂
    A (metaphysical) universal intelligence is in ALL e/matter
    A (metaphysical) universal intelligence is in ALL e/matter
    A (metaphysical) universal intelligence is in ALL e/matter
    A (metaphysical) universal intelligence is in ALL e/matter
    I’m thinking. I need to experience!!!!!!!
    And I do try to remember your analogy, about driving the car, getting out of the car, going into the house and leaving the car behind, with regards to MOVING ONWARD!
    Kindly,
    David 🙂

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